Timeline for How is pronunciation discussed in Chinese?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
12 events
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| May 16, 2013 at 2:03 | comment | added | NS.X. | @StumpyJoePete That's an awesome reference. You should ask a rhetoric question and answer it by yourself to share this knowledge:) | |
| May 15, 2013 at 19:33 | comment | added | Stumpy Joe Pete | @孤影萍踪 天(tiān), 跹(xiān), and 圆(yuán) do all end in [ɛn], while 山(shān) and 关(guān) do not. The rhyming rules for classical chinese poetry are complex and do not have much to do with Mandarin pronunciation. See this for a lengthy exposition of rhyming rules in Classical Chinese poetry. | |
| May 15, 2013 at 18:02 | comment | added | 孤影萍踪 | @StumpyJoePete I think you may need to swich gears from English rhyming to Chinese rhyming, when you learn/use Chinese. For Chinese rhyming, we only consider the final vowels. So for Chinese native speakers, 天 rhymes with 圆 very well, even one is ian and other is uan. See this poem: 火树银花不夜天，弟兄姐妹舞翩跹，歌声唱彻月儿圆。Here 天(tiān), 跹(xiān) and 圆(yuán) rhyme perfectly. Another poem: 黄河远上白云间，一片孤城万仞山。羌笛何须怨杨柳，春风不度玉门关。 Here 间(jiān), 山(shān) and 关(guān) rhyme perfectly. 柳 doesn't rhyme with them, because the end of the 3rd sentence doesn't need to rhyme with others in a poem. | |
| May 15, 2013 at 6:37 | comment | added | NS.X. | @StumpyJoePete No I get it. I was trying to say many native speakers learned this way, it worked for us and will just work for you (language learners) as well, regardless of whether it's linguistically correct. | |
| May 15, 2013 at 3:28 | comment | added | Stumpy Joe Pete | @NS.X. It's entirely possible you both perceive them as rhyming; but that would be a product of your "feeling" for Chinese phonology. If you were a foreign language learner, it would not be helpful to think of 煙 as being 一 + 安. | |
| May 15, 2013 at 0:37 | comment | added | NS.X. | @StumpyJoePete They are pronounced different but they're considered rhyming with each other, at least that's what I was taught all along. | |
| May 15, 2013 at 0:26 | comment | added | Stumpy Joe Pete | @孤影萍踪 "An" is pronounced [an], while "yan" (or the "ian" in words starting with consonants) is pronounced [jɛn]. They're both spelled the same, and it's entirely possible you perceive them the same, but the vowels are different (e.g., pot = [pat], pet = [pɛt]) | |
| May 14, 2013 at 23:31 | comment | added | 孤影萍踪 | @Aerovistae Actually the way I described is used by teachers to show kids how to pronounce pinyin. So for qiǎn, the teach will say: q---i---an---, qian, and finally put 3rd tone on it to make it qiǎn. When students master pinyin very well, they will learn to pronounce new characters according to pinyin. If pinyin is not available for a new character, then the teacher will pronounce it very slow to reveal each individual consonant and vowel. All 声母 and 韵母 have their representative characters, except eng and ong. | |
| May 14, 2013 at 23:07 | comment | added | temporary_user_name | So is that the standard method? Comparison to other characters? | |
| May 14, 2013 at 21:54 | comment | added | 孤影萍踪 | @StumpyJoePete 安 rhymes with 千? When we break down a pronunciation into several parts, we use the first tone always, to simplify the simulation. When we get the whole sound correctly, we put the tone needed. So maybe for you, ān doesn't rhyme with ǎn, but for me they rhyme perfectly. I think in Chinese, tones have no role in rhyme. | |
| May 14, 2013 at 21:35 | comment | added | Stumpy Joe Pete |
I find it somewhat humorous to see 浅 broken down as 七-衣-安 because the "an" in 安 doesn't even rhyme with the "an" in 浅. Of course, the point still stands that you can indicate initials and finals by comparison with other characters.
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| May 14, 2013 at 20:31 | history | answered | 孤影萍踪 | CC BY-SA 3.0 |